Inside the Unmanned System Boom with Infinite Electronics

James Sweetlove sits down with Gabriel Guglielmi, Vice President of Global Product Management at Infinite Electronics, to explore the rapidly expanding world of unmanned systems. From drone swarms on the battlefield to grocery delivery and first responder applications, Gabriel breaks down what "connectivity" really means in this space — and why it's mission-critical for every category of unmanned vehicle, from UAVs to underwater systems.

Gabriel shares his perspective on the geopolitical forces reshaping the drone industry, including China's dominance of the commercial drone market, the US push to onshore production, rare earth material dependencies, and the rise of counter-drone technology. Whether you're an engineer designing for defense or a supply chain professional navigating shifting sourcing regulations, this episode offers a sharp, grounded look at what's driving one of the fastest-growing sectors in electronics.

Resources from this Episode

• Infinite Electronics
• Email Infinite Electronics
• Connect with Gabriel

Listen to the Episode

Watch the Episode

Key Takeaways

• Connectivity is mission-critical for unmanned systems. Reliable signal transmission (RF, fiber, data) is essential for control, safety, and real-time operation across all drone types and environments.
• Unmanned systems are rapidly expanding across domains. From air and ground to sea, underwater, and space, drones are transforming both military operations and civilian use cases like delivery and emergency response.
• Geopolitics and supply chains are reshaping the industry. China dominates production, while the US and Europe are pushing for onshoring, regulation, and reduced reliance on foreign components and rare earths.
• AI and autonomy are accelerating evolution. Drones are moving from remote-controlled systems to autonomous and swarm-based operations, while counter-drone technologies are growing just as quickly.

Transcript

James Sweetlove: Hey everyone, this is James from the CTRL+Listen Podcast, brought to you by Octopart. Today I have a special guest for you. This is Gabriel Guglielmi, vice president of global product management at Infinite Electronics. Thank you so much for coming on the show. It's great to have you.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Hi, James. Thank you for having me. I appreciate that.

James Sweetlove: Anytime. So today, I just wanted to ask you, starting off, about your background. Do you want to tell us a little bit about yourself and what you've done in the industry prior to this?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, absolutely, James. I've been in the component industry for close to 30 years now. The first half of my career, I was in the semiconductor industry at STMicroelectronics, starting from product management and going all the way to managing a few product divisions for STMicroelectronics.

Then, after those 15 years, I moved into the interconnect world in different companies, president roles, GM roles, and then finally joined Infinite Electronics in 2019, where I've been the vice president of global product management, as you said, covering the portfolio of the company.

So let me say more about the company, Infinite Electronics. We are a privately held US company, and Infinite Electronics owns 19 different companies, such as Pasternack, Fairview Microwave, Elcom, etc. Eleven of these 19 companies are in the US, and eight are in Europe. Bulgin is an English company, and then we have seven cable companies all across Europe and North Africa. We're about 2,000 employees. And our products are all related to high-performance connectivity components and solutions.

James Sweetlove: So do you want to maybe explain what that term means? I know people hear that term, connectivity solutions, a lot. What exactly is that space?

Gabriel Guglielmi: That's a great question. Basically, it's transmitting the signals from an emitter to a receiver at a very high level. So that signal can be electrical, such as RF. It could be data, it could be power, it could be fiber optics.

If I use the example of a cell phone, there's a signal getting out of the cell phone, going to the tower, then going to the network, to the receiver, and then there's the same path back to the emitter, right? So that's connectivity.

And that connectivity, in the markets we serve, has to be there all the time. If connectivity is lost, things can happen that are unexpected.

James Sweetlove: Sure. So it's quite a broad term. There's a lot covered in that space. It might actually help if you just narrow it down a little bit. Could you tell us, firstly, what are the main industries that you serve in the space? And then, what is the difference between your ICC and ECA divisions? Because those are some terms I've seen on your site quite a few times.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Okay. So, definitely, at Infinite, we have about half a million standard products in our portfolio across these 19 companies. So we have a very broad product portfolio with about 28 different product categories.

Today, we are organized into four business units across these 19 companies. The first one is focusing on industrial, and as its name says, it's all about factory automation, medical, installation of offices, and so on and so forth.

The second business unit is focused more around data center and network communication, as well as protecting all the signals. So, trying not to go too technical here, but if you look at a cell phone tower, when you have a lightning strike, usually the cell phone tower receives that. So you need protection so that the RF signal is not being damaged.

The third business unit is all about RF products, from cable to amplifier to attenuator, this type of product. And the last one, which we call ICC, is all about cable, and cable serves mostly the equipment industry, such as cranes and large equipment for producing, as well as EV charging stations.

I realize I haven't responded to all your questions, but our industry coverage is broad. We have about 16 to 20 industries that we support across our large portfolio.

James Sweetlove: Wow. Okay. No, I mean, the more I learn about this, it's such a broad space, but it's so important. It impacts so many different areas of different companies, different industries. So I think it's important people understand it and the scope of it.

I wanted to drill down a little bit. There's something you've been talking about with me for a while now, which is your unmanned systems. I know that's an area that's very important in the company right now, and it's an area in general that I know a lot of companies show a lot of interest in. It's kind of crucial to a lot of different areas being developed right now in the industry. Do you want to talk a little bit about what unmanned systems include?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. Definitely, unmanned systems are getting a lot of attention. I'm sure all of us are looking at what's happening in Iran. And the so-called Iran war, and in the past few years, the Ukraine-Russia war. These actors, including ourselves, the US, are using these drones, and they are somehow changing and disrupting the way war is conducted.

But let me go back to your question first. Unmanned systems, right? So unmanned systems cover from space, basically the limit between the atmosphere and space. There are unmanned systems there, and they go all the way to the bottom of the ocean. So there are unmanned systems sitting at the bottom of the ocean, monitoring what's going on there in terms of submarine activity or anything else, boats, ships, and there is everything in between.

So if you go from space, then you have the ones flying, and they can be flying as low as a few meters, but as high as 30,000 or 40,000 feet. That's what people call drones or UAVs, unmanned air vehicles, or unmanned air systems.

And then there are the ones on the ground. People have seen this image of animals, dogs, or larger animals carrying a lot for the troops on the ground. So that's unmanned ground systems.

Then we also have unmanned sea vessels, basically ships and boats. That's where that is. And obviously, as I said earlier, there are unmanned underwater vehicles, or UUVs. So all these unmanned systems are made of all these categories.

James Sweetlove: From what I understand, the reason this is so groundbreaking and so industry-changing is, A, these are doing the roles people have technically done throughout history and been put in danger doing so. It's actually protecting people and saving lives, potentially. But B, it's unlocking areas where we couldn't go as people because of the harm that could be caused to the human body or the stress on the human body.

So places like you said, in the atmosphere or at deep sea, where if you were constructing a vehicle that was manned, you'd have to account for pressures and other conditions that people would have to endure in those spaces.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yeah, absolutely. And so there is a revolution happening. If you look at what an unmanned system is, it's a kind of robot. Some are controlled by humans, some are moving into autonomy, and we may touch on that later.

We talk a lot about it in the combat and war arena, but unmanned systems are also changing our day-to-day society dramatically, and that's giving birth to what we call the low-altitude economy. So I don't want to just talk about the combat one, but maybe talk a little bit about the civilian or commercial applications.

I think one of the most famous ones is grocery delivery to people's houses.

James Sweetlove: Yes. Yeah. I've seen those all over Los Angeles.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. And what is also very critical is first responders. So now you have what are called drones in a box. The drone sits in a box on the top of a building, and when something happens, a fire, a car crash, or a shooting, the first responder will send a drone and see what's going on at that scene.

Based on what the drone sees, then the first responder will decide what to send there. And if there is a robbery, as an example, the drone will follow the car, assuming the thief is in the car. That prevents high-speed chases, which are very dangerous, especially in crowded environments.

So that's what's happening in the city. But if you look outside the city, I was talking earlier about the cell tower. Think about that. The cell tower is in use. It's winter. It's icy. Someone really has to climb there. It's a high-risk job. You can now just send a drone, see what's happening, and make an assessment with cameras. And in the future to come, you can even think about the drone doing some repair there.

So that will first reduce the risk of someone falling from the cell tower. Number two, it will also replace the human, as we know we have a manpower shortage in the economy. So we can have these robots replacing humans that we don't have, and doing that at a much lower cost versus a human.

We're just at the beginning of that revolution of what I call the low-altitude economy.

James Sweetlove: Obviously, in this space, the buzzword that everyone's been saying is artificial intelligence. We won't get too much into it because that's not the point of today's episode, but how much of this do you think would be possible without that input? Do you think this has kind of unlocked the door to all of this stuff?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yeah, that's a great question. Although I said I don't want to talk too much about war, let me go back into the war.

If you look at the Ukraine-Russia war, where the two sides have perfected the use of drones and counter-drones, if you think about connectivity, back to what we do at Infinite Electronics, you have a signal between the operator, somewhere on the ground far away from the battlefield, controlling the drone. The transmission is through RF signals, from the controller to the antenna of the drone, and then the drone reacts to whatever the operator is telling the drone to do.

The change there is that the enemy is jamming the signal. So the outcome could be that the operator loses control of the drone.

Now, there are techniques to prevent the jamming, anti-jamming, then jamming of anti-jamming, and so on and so forth. It's like a never-ending story there.

But there are a few ways to resolve that. One of them is using fiber optics, and now you have this drone flying, being controlled by fiber optics, and then they do whatever they have to do. So that's immune to jamming.

Or there is a radical way of doing that. You put an AI chip into the drone, at a very high level, right? You give the mission to the drone. So before the drone takes off, someone programs what he or she wants the drone to do.

And then the drone takes off and goes to its mission. I'm sure all of you know about Terminator.

James Sweetlove: Yes, of course.

Gabriel Guglielmi: That's what is happening here on the battlefield of the Ukraine-Russia war, where there are drones that fly around until they find their target. Now, the difference between Terminator and us is that they have limited power and energy, so either they accomplish that mission before they run out of battery or gas, or they drop at a point in time. But this is where it's going.

I'm sure there are other things going on that are classified by governments.

James Sweetlove: And then I guess the limiting factor as well, other than batteries, is computing power and reasoning power. So those drones have a very specific programmed-out thing, an outline, and they stick within those parameters. But as it evolves more, I imagine that they're going to become more autonomous so that they can reason and say, okay, if this happens, this is how I react. If this happens, this is what I do. So I guess in that space, the next step is building that intelligence.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, James. All these drones are equipped with sensors, cameras, and LiDAR, and they will be able to perceive what's happening around them.

Let me move another step forward: the concept of a swarm of drones.

So what I've been hearing, and again, I'm sure a lot of things are classified there, is that you would have the control drone, the one with the smart intelligence, that may stay a bit away from, let's say, the danger area. Then around that kind of command drone, there will be a lot of drones that will accomplish a particular mission, whether it's go eliminate a target, go see what's going on behind the line of horizon, or monitor and protect the troops on the ground.

So more and more, we're going to go into this concept of drones controlling drones for more drones and helping the troops on the ground, or doing something totally without any troops on the ground as the battlefield becomes very lethal.

James Sweetlove: Right. And this can obviously be applied outside the battlefield, too. So imagine you have, instead of a drone workforce, one drone managing a team of drones to complete complex tasks.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yeah. The same, by the way, can apply in the industry. Usually, the military, in some aspects, leads, right? They set up some new technology, and then over time it goes into civilian purposes.

You could have totally a team of drones, like we have a team of people accomplishing tasks. We could have a team of drones under the supervision of a kind of command-and-control drone doing all these activities. That is definitely something that will happen.

James Sweetlove: Right. So I guess what's next? What would you say is the next step in progressing down this path? What's holding us back currently as something achievable that we can overcome in this area?

Gabriel Guglielmi: That's a great question. I think if I look a little bit at the unmanned system economy, and we focus a lot on drones because that's the biggest part right now of unmanned systems, which is growing about 15% CAGR.

China historically has been dominating that market, especially on the commercial side. China controls about 90% of the worldwide market.

James Sweetlove: Wow.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. And obviously, DJI is 50% owned by the Chinese government. So they're also supplying drones to the Chinese government, which, by the way, is helping Iran and Russia build their drones.

So right now, obviously I'm not speaking on behalf of the US government, but we are disadvantaged. We don't have an ecosystem in the US to be able to produce that number of drones.

If you look at what's happening in Iran, we already spent four or five billion dollars of missile munitions, while Iran has likely spent 10% or 20% of that.

So the question is, how will you build an ecosystem in the US not only to build the drones and unmanned systems serving the military, but also for the civilian economy?

There are a lot of things happening there. I don't know how much you want me to deep dive, but regulators have published a certain number of laws there to help this.

James Sweetlove: Yeah, I actually have been following that situation. I've been reading quite a bit about that. There's a massive push from the government there to encourage this sort of development in any way possible.

And I did see that there was a festival earlier this year where they showcased that drone technology. I'm not sure if you saw it, the one where they had all of the humanoid drones doing kung fu.

James Sweetlove: Yeah. It's very impressive.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. But let me say more about what's going on. The various government agencies have issued regulation. First, the Department of War, or DOW, formerly DoD, has now put in place a program called Blue UAS, which means that components must not be from China.

And possibly made in the US, although not all of them can be made in the US. Basically, they will have to be certified by the US government to be used by military personnel.

So that's on the military side, and we see more and more in our customers' requirements for having, down the road, US country of origin, and meanwhile moving back the supply chain toward the continental US.

On the commercial side, the FCC has just issued a memo at the end of last year banning any new foreign-made drones and components. So still, you and I can use the existing drones and models, but definitely there is a big push from government to restore not just the production of drones, but all the way down to components, all the way down to batteries, electrical engines, motors, cables, and all the products that we supply in electronics.

I mean, a lot of these connected products go into drones, and we definitely see a big push to move back to the US. It will take years.

James Sweetlove: Yeah, definitely. And then just the actual resources, the base resources that would be required to manufacture some of that stuff, the US doesn't have access to nearly the same suppliers, obviously, as you said, as China. So you have to import those goods in the first place, then manufacture at a higher cost and at a slower rate.

So obviously, there are complications here, and realistically, it's going to take at least 10 to 20 years to be established in any competitive way in the United States, which obviously is a goal worth working toward, but it's not an immediate success. It's physically impossible.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yeah, absolutely. We talk a lot about rare earth materials, for which China controls, I believe, 70% or 80% of the extraction and maybe more refining. But if you look at drones with brushless motors, these motors use rare earth materials. Same for batteries.

It will take years, but I think the current events in Ukraine and Iran are going to accelerate this. There is one reason. If you look at the Shahed drone, which everybody is talking about, it's a drone made by Iran. They cost $35,000, plus or minus, depending on what they are doing. And to take them down, we use a PAC-3, which costs millions of dollars.

So this is called asymmetrical war. We cannot sustain that as a nation. That will accelerate this move. And back to rare earth materials, the Department of War has taken shares in a few companies in the US making rare earth materials. So I'm expecting over time this will accelerate. This conflict will accelerate us moving back into the US or moving that back into friendly countries, such as Australia or England, and so on and so forth.

James Sweetlove: Right. Definitely. And on the European side, is a similar situation happening there as well?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Great question. I'm going to a show in Europe in a couple of weeks, but definitely it's the same situation. I think the wake-up call from Europe has happened sooner than in the US because, obviously, they are closer to Ukraine. In fact, some Ukrainian companies have partnered with European defense companies to produce drones, first because they need to produce drones outside Ukraine, and second, in Europe.

You may have read that last year, James, but a few airports in Europe were shut down because drones were flying over. I think Munich was a high-profile one. And so Europe is really accelerating the adoption of drones and unmanned systems into the battlefield, but also into civilian applications, because Europe is suffering the same issue as the US: lack of manpower.

James Sweetlove: Right. And what about material access as well? Is that an issue there as well?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, the same. I mean, Europe and the US have all relied a lot on sourcing from China, and we all face the same problem. By teaming up, we can accelerate that. Teaming up also enables the acceleration of that.

James Sweetlove: Right, for sure. So just to bring things back to the connectivity side of things, how does this factor into drone technology? What role does that play in the operation of these unmanned systems?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, connectivity is a critical aspect. I touched a little bit on it before, but if you think at a high level about what a drone is, by the way, it's the same for one on the ground or one on the sea. It's slightly different for underwater and space, but there is a need for communication between the operator, the pilot, and the drone. A lot of that is based on RF signals.

Basically, on the controller, you need antennas. You need the amplifier to transmit the signal all the way to the drone, which will have antennas that receive the signals. Then inside the drone, there are cables going all the way to the control unit that will tell the drone what to do, where the drone is, and where the drone needs to go. All this communication has to be done in real time, as you can imagine.

These things are moving, right? They are not stationary.

I mean, not moving as fast as a jet fighter, but they move. So what I've heard as a problem in the field is that the pilot loses sight of the drones. There are micro-interruptions of the signals, and the drone can be off by a certain position.

If you think about the civilian application, recently there was a drone that hit a building in the Dallas area. The drone could hit a building and fall on people. So having communication every time, all the time, is critical.

But there are a few things that are really creating problems. Drones are changing directions, so, as you can think, they are subject to a lot of G-force. It's vibrating. And in the field, they are manipulated in a harsh manner, right? If you think about the soldier on the battlefield, they are not necessarily going to take care of the drone. They will swap the battery, do this, do that, and make it fly. So it's a very harsh environment.

Lastly, if you think about it, a drone could be flying in Antarctica or the desert.

James Sweetlove: Or under the ocean or in the atmosphere.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. Very harsh conditions. And then there are different types of drones. We will not go into details. I'm not sure we have time, but there are the small ones, like we can buy in retail, but there are also the larger ones.

The famous one is MQ-9, and Iran has shot a few of them. So there, or if you think about the drones that are developed by Anduril and Joby Aviation, the collaborative combat aircraft, these are almost like jet fighters.

Without a human. So there, the complexity of what's being done and the mission makes the connectivity extremely critical. You cannot afford to lose a $200 million drone.

James Sweetlove: Definitely. And I guess limitation-wise, here's another question: range. What are we currently looking at range-wise for something like this, for the signal being received?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, I think if there is no jamming or particular stuff happening, they can fly and they can be controlled from very far away. Some surveillance drones, although how long they can stay in the air is classified, I've heard that they can stay days up in the atmosphere watching what's going on on the ground and still have communication.

So again, there is a kind of cat-and-mouse game, as we discussed earlier. I have not touched on this yet, but counter-drone is growing at an even faster rate than drones because now someone has to make sure to basically take down these drones.

I don't know if you saw that, but FEMA has released half a billion dollars in the US. FEMA is to manage the risk in the US.

They have issued half a billion dollars, $500 million, to equip all the stadiums and venues for the World Cup coming up in June because they realize, oh, we have nothing to protect against incoming drones. So it's now creating an entire economy of how do we counter this?

James Sweetlove: Yeah, definitely. You're right. This is both an entire industry and encountering the industry.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, this is going to be a never-ending solution. We are all familiar with Windows software from Microsoft and the CPU from Intel, right? CPU is getting better, software is getting better, and it keeps going on and on and on. I expect the same thing to happen between unmanned systems and counter-unmanned systems.

James Sweetlove: Right. That's the same as antivirus software as well.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, absolutely.

James Sweetlove: Mhm. So I guess to slowly start to bring things home, what would you say people should be paying attention to at the moment? What are some trends that people should keep an eye on?

Gabriel Guglielmi: On unmanned systems?

James Sweetlove: Yeah, on unmanned systems or connectivity, whichever you think is more relevant.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yeah, I think all this ecosystem, if you look at it, and I'm going to talk about the US, but same in Europe, and I'm going to look at the military aspect because it's more developed in the US than the commercial one. You have all the traditional players, such as Lockheed Martin and Raytheon, who used to play and offer systems, and then you have a wave of startups and new companies. We talked about a few of them: Anduril, Nuro, Skydio, etc., which are also disrupting that economy, the defense economy.

Why is it very critical? The startups work at a different pace than what's called the prime contractors.

They change design almost overnight. So speed becomes how we can support them in modifying these designs.

Talking a little bit about Infinite Electronics, one of our key competitive advantages is speed. We can provide all these connectivity components and solutions very quickly to support startups designing and developing these new widgets, drones, and counter-drones, and then they will have to ramp up.

Basically, an entire ecosystem is going to be built over the next few years at a very high speed, with change happening, if not on a monthly basis, maybe quarterly basis, and in a war context, maybe a daily basis.

So how is the entire ecosystem going to be able to do that, to be very flexible but also able to support volumes? And connectivity is going to be key to that.

James Sweetlove: Definitely. And then one last thing. On your website, I saw that you have a number of subject matter experts. Do you want to talk a little bit about who they are, what they cover, and why people should maybe pay attention or read through that?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. I think in our team, we have experts in different markets and unmanned systems. Typically, our experts are what we call product managers, and we have technical support teams. Our sales team is also expert, and as you will see over time, we'll create more and more information about that.

This unmanned economy is nascent in a sense that a lot of these companies did not exist five years ago or 10 years ago. We talk a lot about data centers. Data centers are a big driver of the economy in the US, with a trillion-dollar investment in the next five years. But the unmanned system might not be as big in terms of dollars, but it's going to be billions and billions of dollars coming up.

So definitely, we have a lot of experts in our team. We're also learning as we go in this industry. Things are changing fast. So be open-minded and learn every day.

James Sweetlove: Definitely. And then for anyone who wants to get in touch with the company, to learn more, to speak with you or anyone on your team, what are the best ways to contact all of you?

Gabriel Guglielmi: That's a great question. We have the email address, which is dronesupport@infiniteelectronics.com. So anyone wanting to ask questions, needing products, advice, or feedback, can reach out to us at that email address.

But also feel free to contact me directly. For the company, I'm leading the unmanned systems and robotics initiatives. So feel free to reach out to me directly.

James Sweetlove: And we'll include your LinkedIn profile link in the video description and the website link as well. And then is LinkedIn probably the best way to keep up with what's happening at the company?

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes, we communicate there. We also issue a lot on our website. We have a page, the one I think you read, where we communicate, and we're also going to issue a lot of collateral and communication. I'm not sure, but we have a video about drones showing our capabilities.

James Sweetlove: That's great.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Insisting on the fact that we offer speed, we offer products with the right country of origin, and we are able to co-develop with our customers.

James Sweetlove: Fantastic. Gabriel, thank you so much. It's been really fascinating. I know this topic right now is so hot, so I think a lot of people would be very interested to learn more about it. I think also there's a lot of misunderstanding in this space. I think you clarified some of that stuff.

Gabriel Guglielmi: I'm glad I was able to. Thank you.

James Sweetlove: And yeah, if you want to come back on the show, we'd love to have you because this is such a quickly evolving space, and probably in six to 12 months, it will be a completely different conversation.

Gabriel Guglielmi: Yes. Anytime, James. Thank you so much.

James Sweetlove: Thank you. And for anyone listening, thank you for tuning in, and we have another guest next time.